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27 September 2003 @ 10:55 am
Battleground God  

You have been awarded the TPM medal of honour! This is our highest award for outstanding service on the intellectual battleground.

The fact that you progressed through this activity neither being hit nor biting a bullet suggests that your beliefs about God are internally consistent and very well thought out.

A direct hit would have occurred had you answered in a way that implied a logical contradiction. You would have bitten bullets had you responded in ways that required that you held views that most people would have found strange, incredible or unpalatable. However, you avoided both these fates - and in doing so qualify for our highest award. A fine achievement!

This is interesting considering that I feel that the answers I gave in obtaining this outcome would seem very odd to most people.
Notably, I began by saying that God does exist, later saying it is not rational to believe in God without external evidence.
Interestingly enough, I was not queried on what evidence I believe I have for the existance of God... but I guess that's a much longer discussion and not to be had with a computer!

How did you do compared to other people?

109233 people have completed this activity to date.
You suffered zero direct hits and bit zero bullets.
This compares with the average player of this activity to date who takes 1.37 hits and bites 1.10 bullets.
7.47% of the people who have completed this activity, like you, emerged unscathed with the TPM Medal of Honour.
46.69% of the people who have completed this activity took very little damage and were awarded the TPM Medal of Distinction.
Robet Éivaayvah on September 26th, 2003 07:19 pm (UTC)
I took a hit because I said that a being who one could call "god" should have the power to do anything, and then I later said that god can't have the power to make 1+1=72 or a square circle (I'm not saying a god couldn't change the number system or our language -BUT- they are only representations, and whether it's two apples or due mele, it's still two apples, and not seventy-two.

But I don't really think this should be considered a hit, because it only justifies my lack of belief in god (or God) in the first place.
Outlier Manlukeii on September 26th, 2003 10:00 pm (UTC)
Ahh, but the test was one of rationality.

You said IF there was a God, he/she could do ANYTHING

and then when they said:

OK - Hypothetically speaking there IS a God - can he do THIS - and you said NO

So you were DIRECTLY contradicitng yourself.

The second question wasn't "Do you believe in God?" nor was it "Do you believe the God that others believe in can do this?"

So there... :þ
Jacobyak_boy on September 26th, 2003 10:58 pm (UTC)
That's exactly why I said that God is not necessarily omnipotent, because that would mean the universe itself has no overriding rules, that GOd Himself has no governing rules. This is possible, sure, but doesn't fit my view of God, which is what they were testing.
Robet Éivaayvah on September 27th, 2003 06:34 pm (UTC)
I believe that something deserving the title of God (particularly with the capital G) should be able to do it. I don't believe that any of the beings that one is calling God is able to do it. I believe that I should be doing homework every night but I er... don't. I think "God" should be called "the mighty George" or "the invisible Gary".

Really though, I guess I don't have any reason to believe that a god doesn't exist, but the only gods that seemed at all realistic to me were back in Greek (and later Roman) religion. They were notably human (they were at times jealous, and at others noble) and are now classified as myth. God strikes me as a kind of "action hero" kind of god, the kind that can shoot a car's tire and therefore somehow cause it to explode.

People give "God" power that defies all logic.
Jacobyak_boy on September 27th, 2003 10:01 pm (UTC)
You really then believe that if there is a god, he is as flawed as any human... just with...superpowers?
Robet Éivaayvah on September 28th, 2003 12:05 am (UTC)
God apparently did, afterall, create man in his own image.
Mr Sinisterglintsinisterglint on September 28th, 2003 07:08 am (UTC)
New from Mattel
God, now with Kung Fu grip (accessories sold separately).
Jacobyak_boy on September 28th, 2003 03:33 pm (UTC)
Re: New from Mattel
Mr Sinisterglintsinisterglint on September 29th, 2003 03:30 am (UTC)
What, no plastic basket of fishes and loaves? No shepherd's crook? What a rip-off.

Still, I can't wait to get the Golgotha Action Playset with Detachable Crosses, or the Last Supper Funset (Featuring Bonus Judas with Thirty Pieces of Silver).

The Power of Christ Compels You to Buy It.
Jacobyak_boy on September 30th, 2003 12:41 am (UTC)
It's the Punch and Jesus show!

And this time JC ain't taken no shit from nobody.
Jacobyak_boy on September 28th, 2003 03:23 pm (UTC)
So they say. But I don't take that stuff literally.
Robet Éivaayvah on September 28th, 2003 05:37 pm (UTC)
Whether or not its literal, most of the passages I've read that depict God, depict Him as a not-so-perfect deity with a personality. They say He's perfect and all, but would a perfect God really end up making the mistakes that would make, Noah's Ark, Jesus, etc necessary?

I find it a little odd though, how in Revelations they seem to often call God "jealous", but I haven't found what He's supposedly jealous of...
Jacobyak_boy on September 28th, 2003 05:59 pm (UTC)
I'm not sure what you mean about Jesus being a mistake.

But much of the Old Testament, especially stories like the Creation and Noah's Ark, is just fable in my opinion. Myths like in any culture, to explain the unexplainable.

Again, Revelations reads like a bad trip and I tend to disregard it.

Unlike a lot of Christians, I am willing to admit that the Bible was written by a bunch of blokes way-back-when, and is therefore not the irrefutable WORD OF GOD. If it was, why is it so contradictory. I pretty much try to follow Jesus' teachings and not worry about the details.

Sorry to quote scripture to you but this is pretty much the only line from the Bible that I feel anyone need pay any heed to. If you follow this but ignore the rest, you'll be doing just fine:

John 13:34 "A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another."

The whole jealous god thing is fire and brimstone bullshit. God loves us and just wants us to be nice to one another. But since He created us, if we're a bit flawed He's hardly going to punish us for it.
Robet Éivaayvah on September 28th, 2003 09:17 pm (UTC)
I wasn't talking about those events being a mistake (though I suppose the rainbow was supposedly an indication that flooding the world wasn't a nice thing to do). It was that they required a mistake in the first place.

God should be able to get the religion right the first time.

Another mistake: Eden story. If God created man, then he'd know that they'd eat the forbidden fruit. In fact, he would have known from the beginning that Satan would betray him...

I have to say, that Terry Pratchett (and er... that other guy) do present the most feasable depiction of God that I've read.
Jacobyak_boy on September 28th, 2003 09:33 pm (UTC)
As I said, I think these early stories (Eden, Noah etc) are pure fable. I certainly don't believe in Satan. he is just a personification of the internal temptation that we suffer.

I now understand what you meant by Jesus. Jesus was a messenger. God decided that we needed to be told one or two things and thought sending someone to stir things up a bit would be a good way of doing that. Evidently God was right. I don't see any flaw in this plan (if you mention religious wars, you lose a testicle). Everyone now has access to the message and may follow it or not as they see fit. Of course interpretations vary, but as I say if you really, truly follow the above passage, you can't go wrong.

God created man with free will, I do not believe in pre-determination. God intended us to be able to do the wrong thing if we want to, but we also have the ability to recognise right from wrong and do the right thing.

The other guy is Neil Gaiman.
Robet Éivaayvah on September 28th, 2003 09:40 pm (UTC)
So... you don't believe that God is doing the "You can pick any colour you like, as long as it's blue," thing? (ie "You can pick any religion you like, but if you don't pick Christianity, you burn in hell.").

I have read small parts of the bible, but mostly it's been revelations, Eden, Satan and the Antichrist. The rest is just what I've picked up.
Jacobyak_boy on September 28th, 2003 09:54 pm (UTC)
You've picked the wrong parts to read.
Try the gospel of John, best book in the Bible.

I don't even believe in hell, so I guess not.
I'm even willing to say that perhaps God has sent other messengers like Buddha, for instance.
The message always gets pretty jumbled.

As I say, the fundamental tenet of Christianity is that we should be nice to each other. It doesn't matter whether you pray, go to church, have sex, masturbate, turn on a light switch on the Sabbath...
Xhanthilast_reprise on September 27th, 2003 05:02 am (UTC)
Jesus, what is it with you and God?
Jacobyak_boy on September 27th, 2003 05:57 am (UTC)